If You Like Chardonnay, Try A Weed Drink, Part 3

274. Alcohol and Cannabis Part 3

Ellen Scanlon: [00:00:00] This podcast discusses cannabis and is intended for audiences 21 and over.

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Jane West: Everybody wants to feel better. Everyone wants to have a good time. Everyone wants to take these different substances to feel different and to, you know, enjoy themselves. But to me, the goal is to figure out the least amount of these substances that you need to take to feel great.

Ellen Scanlon: Welcome to how to do the pod, an award winning podcast, helping you feel confident about cannabis.

I’m your host, Ellen Scanlon.[00:02:00]

You just heard from Colorado based Jane West, a long time cannabis advocate and entrepreneur. This is the final episode in our series on alcohol and cannabis. In this three part series, I have covered a lot. In part one, we explored the rise and fall of prohibition in the 1920s and how it reshaped drinking habits in America.

In part two, we fast forwarded to today, where younger generations are rethinking alcohol and turning to low dose cannabis as a more approachable and social option. You’ll hear women’s personal stories and expert insights into what’s driving this shift. Now in part three, we’re diving into what’s next.

Just a few weeks ago, the U. S. Surgeon General recommended adding warning labels to alcoholic beverages. I got [00:03:00] curious and looked up when cigarette warning labels were first introduced. It was in 1964. At that time, over 40 percent of Americans smoked cigarettes. Today, that number is just 12%. Change takes time, and we’re starting to see a real shift in awareness around alcohol.

More data is emerging about alcohol’s links to cancer and its impact on sleep, mood, and just overall health. Yet, like many of you, I still drink and I really enjoy a beer or a glass of sparkling wine. Most people I’ve talked to aren’t planning to quit drinking entirely, they’re just taking a closer look at why they drink and considering alternatives like non alcoholic beverages or cannabis drinks.

In today’s episode, we’ll talk about how low dose cannabis is reshaping social norms now that it’s [00:04:00] available in more than just dispensaries. We’ll dig into what it actually means to feel high and hear from women who are being very intentional about alcohol and cannabis and finding more ways to relax and still feel great the next day.

Have you signed up for my Substack newsletter yet? I share podcast highlights, inspiring stories, cannabis brand discounts, and some of my favorite personal recommendations. Recently, I was featured in Sophia is Voracious, a fun Substack newsletter written by New York based Sophia Aronsky. Sophia loves hosting dinner parties and she noticed a trend.

More of her friends were saying, yes, I’d love to come, but is it okay if I’m not drinking? Sophia reached out to me for tips on throwing a California sober party where all of your guests feel comfortable. I’ll link to it in the show notes if you want to check it out. If [00:05:00] you are already one of our 10, 000 plus newsletter readers, your free access stays the same.

And now with Substack, you can choose to upgrade to a paid subscription and directly support the show and our work. Subscribe today at Substack or do the pot. com and get fresh ideas delivered straight to your inbox. Thank you for your support of the show.

New York based Marnie Unger, the director of sales and business development at Eaton Botanicals, has noticed a big shift in her relationship with alcohol since she started working in the cannabis industry.

Marni Unger: At the end of the day, I think that alcohol is poison and I think that cannabis is medicine. I think that alcohol has extremely addictive qualities that cannabis doesn’t have in the same way.

One of the [00:06:00] most beautiful things about being in the cannabis industry is a lot of people don’t drink and so being around other folks who are using cannabis over alcohol and even if they are combining the two, it’s not consuming large quantities of alcohol. It’s really enjoyable. People are so nice.

People don’t, you know, get Snippy or mean or stay stupid things. You don’t do things that you regret the next day, or you don’t remember the next day. You don’t wake up with a hangover. I feel like conversations are more meaningful. I feel like they’re more present. It’s such a safer energy. I mean. The creeps don’t come out, right?

I mean, it’s a very different dynamic because people are grounded. I think that cannabis is something that brings all kinds of people together in a really unique, beautiful [00:07:00] way. I think that’s a really different quality than alcohol provides.

Ellen Scanlon: Marnie still enjoys a glass of wine. She’s also thoughtful about mixing alcohol and cannabis.

She offers her tips for keeping things comfortable with weed and shares how her idea of fun has changed over the years.

Marni Unger: I mean, I like a good glass of wine. If I do combine cannabis and alcohol, it’s low on both. Because I really personally do not enjoy the experience of having too much of them together.

It doesn’t make me feel good. Feel good in any way, mentally, physically, everybody’s body is different. So cannabis and alcohol affect everybody differently. And therefore also the interaction of the two is going to feel different in different bodies. For me, I don’t personally enjoy large quantities of both of them together.

I also think, look, [00:08:00] if you asked me that same question 10 years ago, I’d have a really different answer. I think it all depends on like where we’re at in our lives and what fun feels like. I don’t enjoy the same type of drinking that I did in my 20s. And so as I’ve gotten older, I really try to Not drink as much alcohol for all of the reasons and then kind of substitute that with cannabis use.

It makes me feel a lot better.

Ellen Scanlon: If you’ve been listening to the show for a while, you might remember our series, The First Time I Bought Legal Weed. Women from all across the country shared their stories about that milestone moment. Buying legal cannabis for the first time was and still is a big deal for something that was illegal for so long.

Stepping into a dispensary can feel intimidating, especially for women who might not know what to expect or what to buy. [00:09:00] This hesitation has slowed the mainstream adoption of cannabis and probably contributes to the lingering stigma. Nicole Brown, a New York based innovation and strategy consultant, has worked in the cannabis industry since 2019.

She’s seen firsthand how the retail shopping experience has evolved, opening the door for more women to feel confident exploring cannabis.

Nicole Brown: Thinking about some of those early places I went to in Colorado and California, which make it a very sterile environment, you know, you kind of have blackout glass and it’s very intimidating.

So I still feel like there is work to be done and a lot is. still gonna evolve to create a retail experience that is going to be more mainstream and more welcome. So I would say a decade in, I would have hoped that we would have figured that out a little bit better. I think you’re still at these two extremes.

One is this like. I call it like the bulletproof glass model. Like we’ve opened a liquor [00:10:00] stores that look like that too. And the other is this kind of like very artisanal whole foods, high end Apple store. And there’s gotta be something in the middle that I think is going to be successful. We’re not quite there yet.

Ellen Scanlon: Until recently, if you wanted to buy cannabis legally, your only option was to visit a dispensary in a state with medical or adult use laws. Things have changed dramatically in the past few years.

Nicole Brown: In the past few years, I think the marijuana category has done a good job at demystifying and kind of creating more of an open environment for people to come to a dispensary and feel like they have the confidence to cross that threshold, but it’s still such a small fraction.

Of the user base. And that’s why, as you’ve seen over the past few years, really, since about 2020, with the proliferation of hemp derived products, and that’s where you’re starting to see products that have delta 9 THC from hemp, that THC, that is the same active [00:11:00] ingredient you find in a marijuana plant, so you’re very much being able to have access to So, Similar products with similar effects, whether that’s a beverage, a gummy, a tincture, etc.

Ellen Scanlon: Many dispensaries have created a more welcoming experience. And still, for a lot of people, visiting a dispensary is a big hurdle. In our series, Weed Drinks 101, I talked about the rise of legal hemp derived cannabis products. I’ll add a link to that series in the show notes. What you need to know is that in many states, you can now buy hemp derived products in places like your local liquor store or even door dash them to your house.

Nicole Brown: You know, now that consumers can find those products outside of the walls of the dispensary, you’re starting to see much more adoption, much more awareness in general of the cannabis category and of the associated products [00:12:00] like beverages and edibles than you have before. And so it has proven the concept of the biggest barrier to entry here has always been.

That the products are locked up in these dispensaries that not everyone feels comfortable visiting or going into, even once they’re there, they might not feel comfortable or confident having a conversation with a bud tender. And even if they do, the products that are available are not necessarily speaking to a mainstream population.

Most often in a dispensary, the majority of the menu is. It’s very high dose products and lots of the new consumers are looking for a low dose option. And that’s really where you’ve seen these hemp derived products, whether they’re edibles or beverages, which is the two most common formats in low dose.

Being able to be ordered online and delivered directly to your door. They might be [00:13:00] available at a local grocery, a local bodega, a local store that you could just walk into, or you might be there to purchase another product. So that ease of access has. I’ve been allowing more people to come into the category than ever before on the latest surveys that people like me will read and otherwise that you’ll see more people saying, yes, I’ve tried a cannabis product in the last three months, six months, nine months, or yes, I regularly consume.

Cannabis consumption is at an all time high and it is because it’s not only limited to the dispensary retail model at this time.

Ellen Scanlon: If you’ve tried a cannabis beverage in the past and thought it tasted too planty, you’re not alone. Nicole explains what has changed.

Nicole Brown: If you tried a cannabis beverage five or 10 years ago, [00:14:00] you probably didn’t have a very good experience. It probably didn’t taste very good and it probably tasted like weed.

And so, now that there’s been so many advancements in the space, you can actually make much more sophisticated beverages that have wonderful flavor profiles.

Ellen Scanlon: From low dose flavor forward options to the convenience of online ordering, today’s cannabis beverages are becoming a popular choice alongside seltzers and craft beers.

Nicole Brown: What you’re starting to see now and most often seeing outside the walls of a dispensary are low dose beverage products. 2 milligrams, 3 milligrams, 5 milligrams of THC. Um, most often you’re seeing it canned like a seltzer. Kind of 8 ounce, 10 ounce can. Flavored or unflavored so that you’re able to have an experience that is It’s much more social, much more measured and fits into the real routine.

So cannabis [00:15:00] beverages, the way that they’ve started to enter the market now over the past couple of years is in that low dose category. So it’s positioning the products of saying, okay, great. You could make a choice here between having, maybe you want to have a craft beer. Or a spike seltzer or a low dose cannabis beverage.

Ellen Scanlon: Nicole sees a connection between the success of White Claw and the rise of cannabis beverages.

Nicole Brown: I do think White Claw actually opened the door for all these cannabis beverages too, because like White Claw created its own category and then. Cannabis was able to kind of follow suit and sit on shelf right beside it.

White claw, you know, consumer insight there was somewhat targeted to women, definitely targeted to a younger demographic. So they were being quite sensitive to A younger generation that wasn’t interested in drinking wine was less interested in drinking alcohol and beer. And so what [00:16:00] was a product that could appeal to this kind of younger millennial kind of like upcoming Gen Z target that would be a good fit for them.

So I think they were actually surprised at how well it did resonate with a male audience. where I think there might have been more of an intent for it to be more split or more female and it actually got adopted quite quickly and more broadly. Now you have So many kind of white cloth adjacent products, but light has a seltzer.

Topo Chico has a seltzer. Like they’re all doing it now. I do think cannabis beverages also have that appeal. And you’re seeing that direct target going to a female consumer.

Ellen Scanlon: As cannabis drinks are increasingly finding their place in the beverage aisle, they’re sparking some big questions. Like what does it actually mean to feel high?

Nicole Brown: What does it mean to be high or be stoned? The stigma of that is like everything we’ve seen in the movies. It’s, it’s half [00:17:00] baked. It’s the guy on his couch eating chips. And so redefining that to say, Hey, actually, like having A low dose edible or a low dose beverage is actually going to elicit a response where it’s like we’re actually feeling relaxed, social, outgoing.

I think people still have that kind of like connection between weed equals asleep on the couch, having the munchies, it’s like all of the tropes. THC on its own is a stimulant in the right doses, actually can make you feel quite alert. Quite open minded, quite effervescent.

Ellen Scanlon: That stigma has held a lot of people back from trying cannabis, even in low doses.

So why would someone choose a THC drink over alcohol, or even a non alcoholic option?

Nicole Brown: What is going to make you feel good, whether that is something that Just tastes really good or makes you feel really [00:18:00] good, whether or not it has a buzz or not. I can’t drink tequila. First of all, I hate the taste of it and it makes me super anxious.

It’s a non starter for me, but I love the taste of wine. So like, am I drinking wine to have an experience, be functional? And it’s like, I think wine is delightful and delicious and I only drink French wine because I think it’s the best. So it’s very much about. It’s like more about why am I choosing to have this beverage at this particular moment is really very individual.

And we’re very lucky that we now have more and more choices to be made there.

Ellen Scanlon: As I’ve been working on our alcohol and cannabis series, I have learned so much. Did you know that Dry January started with one woman in the UK giving up alcohol so she could train for a half marathon? That was back in 2013. Fast [00:19:00] forward to today, and last year in the US, 25 percent of adults gave it a try.

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Jane West, who you heard from at the beginning of the show, has spent a lot of time reflecting on her relationship with alcohol and cannabis. She shares how she’s learned to navigate the balance between the two.

Jane West: I do drink alcohol. I was born and raised in Wisconsin, where alcohol is literally everywhere.

Like, there’s a wine tap at like Chuck E. Cheese. It’s everywhere. I mean, I’ve actively been trying to not drink as much alcohol for as long as I can remember, right? Like, I’m like, okay, this is not good for me. And when I was younger, when I was like in my twenties and in college, I definitely consumed too much alcohol or like would [00:21:00] blackout sometimes.

And, you know, just that was the way it was back in the day in the nineties, like keggers and things. I am definitely better without alcohol, but it is something that is like pretty prevalent in our lives. The calorie element. of alcohol is unquestionable, especially as you get like older and older. It definitely is not good for your metabolism.

And so that’s makes it easier for me to stay away from it.

Ellen Scanlon: Whether it’s choosing her favorite drink or knowing exactly when to take an edible, Jane shares what works best for her.

Jane West: I generally just drink either champagne or tequila, like those are my drinks of choice at this point in my life, and I prefer cannabis though.

Gummies take a little while to set in, so if we’re like going out, I usually will take a gummy like as I’m getting in the shower. As I’m like starting to get ready and having it be like part of my night. [00:22:00] So that by the time I’m leaving, I’m starting to feel it. And then from there, I do just try to minimize it.

Like, I know that still to this day, if I have one too many drinks, not too much cannabis, but one too many drinks, that’s when I’m going to be like a little blurry on the end of the night. and definitely like not driving and also maybe just like, I don’t know, like I’m like, was I talking too much?

Everybody wants to feel better. Everyone wants to have a good time. Everyone wants to take these different substances to feel different and to, you know, enjoy themselves. But, to me, the goal is to figure out the least amount of these substances that you need to take to feel great. The one thing that I’ve learned over time, I’m like approaching 50, is like, there’s a moment in using any good substance that you’re like, I want more!

Right? Okay? Like, I’m [00:23:00] having such a good time. So, that is not the moment that you need more. And so, pause. And wait. It’s hard, I know. Until that feeling starts to actually fade. To consume more of anything. But I think people have a tendency in that moment to be like, Yeah! Let’s get shots! Or yeah! Let’s light that other blunt!

And it’s like Ride it out. Ride out that amazing feeling until it starts to fade and then dip back in, you know.

Ellen Scanlon: Thank you for listening to this three part series. My goal is to help you navigate these fast moving changes and figure out how cannabis and alcohol can fit into your life in ways that feel right for you.

I always reach out to the most knowledgeable experts I can find, and I’m here to answer your questions. If there’s a topic you’re curious about or something that you want covered, don’t hesitate to DM me or email me at hi at do the pot dot [00:24:00] com. Special thanks to Ian Dominguez of Delta Emerald Ventures for his help with this series.

If you’re curious about the intersection of cannabis, adult beverages, and technology, subscribe to his newsletter, Delta Dispatch on Substack. I’ll add a link in the show notes. I hope this series helps you feel confident as you discover what works best for you, whether that’s a glass of wine, a THC drink, or both.

This is a hot topic right now, so please share the series with a friend. Thank you.

For lots more information and past episodes, visit DoThePot. com, and that’s also where you can sign up for our newsletter. If you like How to Do the Pot, please rate and review us on Apple Podcasts. It really helps more people find the show. Thank you to our producers, Maddy Fair and Nick [00:25:00] Patry. I’m Ellen Scanlon and stay tuned for more of How to Do the Pot.