Election Countdown: Where the Presidential Candidates Stand on Weed

[00:00:00] Ellen Scanlon: This podcast discusses cannabis and is intended for audiences 21 and over.

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[00:01:01] Jane West: 10 years ago when I started, it was Colorado and Washington and everyone was like, that’s a crazy wild west experiment. This is never going to happen. So if all of this could be made up to get to the point where we are in the past 10 years, The next wave of advocacy and people really fighting for access for the next 10 years could change it all over again.

[00:01:23] Ellen Scanlon: Welcome to How to Do the Pot, a podcast helping you feel confident about cannabis. I’m your host, Ellen Scanlon.

[00:01:37] Ellen Scanlon: You just heard from Jane West, the Colorado based founder of the cannabis accessories brand Jane West. She’s also co founder of Women Grow, an advocacy group promoting diverse leadership in the cannabis industry. This week’s episode is here to help you understand all you need to know about cannabis ahead of the November election.

[00:01:57] Ellen Scanlon: Before we get into what’s happening now, I want to briefly take you back in time, way back, to the presidential election of 1932. To set the scene, the stock market had crashed in 1929 and the Great Depression was making life terribly difficult for many Americans. Immigration, jobs, feeding your family, these critical issues were causing emotions to run very high.

[00:02:26] Ellen Scanlon: The country was tense and polarized. In this election, there were a lot of single issue voters. And what was the issue on the minds of most Americans in 1932? Ending the prohibition of alcohol. Democrat Franklin Roosevelt campaigned on a promise to abolish the 13 year ban on the manufacture, sale, and transportation of alcoholic beverages.

[00:02:55] Ellen Scanlon: In a stunning landslide victory, Roosevelt defeated the incumbent Republican President Herbert Hoover and captured nearly 90 percent of the electoral votes. The following year, a new constitutional amendment was ratified that officially ended prohibition. Alcohol has been legal for adults ever since.

[00:03:18] Ellen Scanlon: It’s been more than 90 years. I’m sharing this story because not so long ago, families were deeply divided, and the country was deeply divided over whether it would be legal for adults to drink alcohol. Something that we take for granted today. The saying goes that history doesn’t repeat itself, but it rhymes.

[00:03:41] Ellen Scanlon: Wherever you stand on the political issues of today, I hope you exercise your rights by voting. Stay tuned for our new three part series on alcohol and cannabis coming soon. We’ll cover the fascinating history of how alcohol was legalized in the U. S. and lots more. Don’t miss it. In today’s episode, we’re diving into where the current presidential candidates stand on cannabis.

[00:04:09] Ellen Scanlon: We’ll explore the key differences in cannabis legalization between red states and blue states, and share the policies to watch over the next four years, regardless of who takes the White House. I’m very excited to share that How to Do the Pot has been nominated for an Anthem Award. The award honors the purpose and mission driven work of people, companies, and organizations worldwide and amplifies voices that are inspiring global change.

[00:04:39] Ellen Scanlon: I’m very proud to be nominated alongside MTV Studios, ABC News, McKinsey Health Institute, and Maria Shriver’s Sunday Paper. How to Do the Pots Menopause 101 Series is a finalist in the Community Voice category. October is Menopause Awareness Month, so check out that series if you haven’t yet. We really need your support to win the Anthem Award.

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[00:05:35] Ellen Scanlon: I’m excited to introduce a new section called Women We Love, celebrating amazing women who also like weed. Plus in every newsletter, I share four of my personal recommendations, like the podcast books or events that are inspiring me. If you’re already one of our 10, 000 plus subscribers, your free access stays the same.

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[00:06:27] Ellen Scanlon: Pennsylvania based Vivian Azar has two decades of experience researching the alcohol, tobacco and cannabis industries for major banks. She was the first research analyst on wall street to take cannabis seriously. She’s a regular on CNBC and she’s advised some of the world’s top investors. A fun fact, Vivian and I went to first grade together at a small all girls school in Virginia.

[00:06:55] Ellen Scanlon: I’m very grateful to her for joining us today to break down everything we need to know about cannabis ahead of the election. I asked Vivian to explain where Donald Trump and Kamala Harris stand on cannabis.

[00:07:10] Vivien Azer: It’s so interesting that both of their policy stances have evolved since Harris entered the election.

[00:07:16] Vivien Azer: And I’ll remind your audience that when Harris was debating Mike Pence on the VP debate in 2020, she had vocalized her support for cannabis. And that was the first time we had heard that. So that was a big deal. Harris has moved further on her stated cannabis policy. Initially, when Harris took the top of the ticket, she had been vocally supportive of continuing the work that’s already underway under the Biden administration with the Department of Justice.

[00:07:43] Vivien Azer: Recently, she put out a new policy proposal that is called Opportunity Agenda for Black Men, and we’re about three weeks out from, from the election when she made that announcement. And that does include full federal legalization. You have to do that with Congress. Donald Trump, as a Florida resident, started getting questions on Amendment 3 in Florida.

[00:08:05] Vivien Azer: Amendment 3 is for the adult use legalization of cannabis in Florida. And so he subsequently came out on Truth Social and said that, you know, he was going to vote for Amendment 3, which is a break from Governor DeSantis, who’s opposing that measure and the ballot initiatives that voters are going to have the ability to vote on.

[00:08:23] Vivien Azer: Trump vocalized that on Truth Social and said that he’s also in support of safe banking, which is a piece of legislation that certainly institutional investors have been waiting for for quite some time, which would improve cannabis company access to to the banking system, which is a big impediment for enterprises that deal in legal cannabis.

[00:08:44] Ellen Scanlon: The Safe Banking Act is federal legislation that would provide legal cannabis businesses with access to banking services like bank accounts and credit cards, which they don’t have right now. Vivian explains why safe banking is so important for cannabis businesses.

[00:09:00] Vivien Azer: So, in the eyes of the federal government, cannabis is a Schedule I narcotic, which means it’s as bad as heroin and worse than cocaine.

[00:09:10] Vivien Azer: And because of that, even though companies are operating legally at the state level, moving money across state borders is considered potentially violating anti money laundering laws. And that’s why it’s illegal. It’s been really hard for cannabis companies to have bank accounts with large financial institutions because they don’t want to get charged by the regulators to be in violation of anti money laundering laws.

[00:09:38] Vivien Azer: So they’ve had to get quite creative as a result of that. It’s passed a number of times in the House and it has come out of the Senate Finance Committee but has not gotten a Senate vote.

[00:09:49] Ellen Scanlon: The Safe Banking Act has passed seven times in the House with strong bipartisan support and its share of drama.

[00:09:58] Ellen Scanlon: Vivian explains more.

[00:10:00] Vivien Azer: The unfortunate reality was that it became a little bit of a political football in the 2022 lame duck session. And Mitch McConnell saw that as an opportunity to potentially embarrass him. Chuck Schumer. Chuck Schumer had been really vocal about cannabis, um, but he was making very big promises during that first session of Congress, the first two years of the Biden administration, because there was so much enthusiasm because Democrats took control of the White House and both branches of Congress.

[00:10:28] Vivien Azer: And so, you know, Schumer was promising, you know, full legalization and industry insiders like myself were like, that’s not possible. You’re not going to get. 10 Republican senators to vote for this, like you need 60 vote majority in the Senate to pass something like that. Let’s go for easy wins, like access to banking, potentially access to capital markets, i.

[00:10:50] Vivien Azer: e. being able to put a stock on a traditional U. S. stock exchange like the New York Stock Exchange or the, or the NASDAQ. Mitch McConnell torpedoed that during the lame duck session in, in December of, of 2022. So then industry advocates and I think Democrats writ large started focusing on more attainable wins.

[00:11:08] Vivien Azer: Obviously this most recent session of Congress has not been all that productive. So expectations have been very low about getting anything done in cannabis.

[00:11:17] Ellen Scanlon: In Congress, the session before the new president is inaugurated is called a lame duck session. Vivian shares why it can actually be a good time for making deals and what could change in cannabis policy in the next few months.

[00:11:32] Vivien Azer: What’s so interesting about DC is that the lame duck session is really important. So much mandatory almost legislation just doesn’t get done during the year, but like you have to fund the government. And so that’s when continuing resolutions get passed and last minute budget deals get done. I was at a conference in Chicago recently, and there were a couple of current politicians who spoke on the matter.

[00:11:55] Vivien Azer: And I think the general expectation is, if the Republicans sweep in 24, nothing happens in lame duck. If the Democrats sweep in 24, also nothing gets done in lame duck. And the logic behind that is, if you know you’re about to have more power, Tomorrow than you do today, then you don’t do anything because then you can really affect your ideal legislative pathways and aspirations, and there’s really no need to compromise if we come out of the November 5th elections, and there’s a divided government that we’re walking into in 2025, maybe there’s the potential for something to happen because there’s more openness to bipartisanship.

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[00:13:18] Ellen Scanlon: Currently, cannabis is legal for adult use in 24 states plus Washington, D. C., and it’s legal for medical use in 38 states. I asked Vivian if there are blue state and red state approaches to legalizing cannabis.

[00:13:35] Vivien Azer: The blue states, number one, have been on the cutting edge of legalizing cannabis. So the first 10 states were all done by ballot initiatives, with the exception of Alaska, I would categorize them as all blue states.

[00:13:48] Vivien Azer: Where you’re now seeing red states legalizing cannabis. is also via ballot initiative, where the, the blue states, you’re now starting to see referrals from the state legislature. So for instance, in, in New Jersey, but I believe this also happened in Ohio, the state legislature can say, we’re not going to make this decision, but we’re going to.

[00:14:08] Vivien Azer: put it to the voters. And then some state legislatures are kind of just taking it upon themselves to, to get it done. Virginia would be one of those where the state legislature, which is controlled by Democrats, and the bill was signed by a Democrat who was the predecessor of, of Governor Yuncken, um, who was a Republican.

[00:14:25] Vivien Azer: He was voted in in 2019. That was a fully Democratic initiative and that was, It’s totally done by the legislative and executive branches at the state level in Virginia. So, you know, not every state has access to a ballot initiative. That’s why New York also had to do it through the legislature and through the executive branch.

[00:14:45] Ellen Scanlon: Vivian tells us the key states to watch for cannabis policy in this election.

[00:14:50] Vivien Azer: Florida is the big one. So there are two constitutional amendments that, that voters are very focused on. One is on abortion and one is on cannabis. And I call that out because it feels a lot like what we saw in Ohio in November of 2023 when they had their special election.

[00:15:10] Vivien Azer: Those two amendments in Ohio. had so much consumer overlap. So both measures passed with over 2. 2 million voters in support. The difference between abortion and cannabis was 985 votes. And so that’s why if you want to be optimistic about Florida, you’re actually really glad that abortion is on the ballot.

[00:15:32] Vivien Azer: Now, In both of those instances in Ohio, those measures pass with 57 percent support. That is not going to be enough for Florida. In 2006, the Florida voters put in a new rule for ballot initiatives that require a supermajority. So it has to get 60 percent support. Which is a pretty high threshold. You know, you see it in, in blue states all the time.

[00:15:55] Vivien Azer: Like in the 2020 election, Maryland had a ballot initiative, very blue state. It passed, and it passed with 67 percent support. But there were a couple of red states in 2020 that had ballot initiatives that did not pass. Arkansas, North Dakota, and South Dakota. And each of those got between 44 and 47 percent support.

[00:16:16] Vivien Azer: So, you know, there’s a pretty wide gap in terms of cannabis enthusiasm between red states and blue state voters. I think Florida voters are very much aware of the 60 vote threshold. A couple of years ago, they narrowly passed an amendment on giving voting rights to felons again. The people that were advocating for that policy change had to make it very clear to Florida voters, like, this isn’t 50 percent plus one.

[00:16:41] Vivien Azer: It’s a much, much bigger lift to pass that amendment.

[00:16:44] Ellen Scanlon: Colorado based Jane West, who you heard from at the beginning of the episode, is a cannabis industry pioneer. Jane encourages everyone to stay informed about cannabis policy in your home state. Local engagement really shapes cannabis laws.

[00:17:02] Jane West: patchwork of states.

[00:17:04] Jane West: And so if you care enough about what’s happening in cannabis and want to know more, you have to find out what is going on in your state, because that is where you’re going to be able to use your voice to affect the most change possible. So like, is HomeGrow legal in your state? How do you determine where a dispensary opens and how you get a license to own a dispensary?

[00:17:28] Jane West: How do you determine, um, How many people get to cultivate cannabis and where and how? These are all laws that are being made on a local level and a state by state level. And so really that’s where you need to get involved and find out more.

[00:17:46] Ellen Scanlon: New York based attorney Katie Neer is a founder of KND Group, which provides legal, regulatory, and government affairs strategies for businesses in highly regulated industries.

[00:17:58] Ellen Scanlon: Katie helps us take a step back and appreciate the significance of this moment. For the first time in history, both presidential candidates have public positions on cannabis.

[00:18:11] Katie Neer: I think there’s a lot of anxiety around the industry regarding that rescheduling and a lot of tension between industry and advocates for the right way or the right path forward at that federal level for this substance and TBD on what will happen.

[00:18:28] Katie Neer: But at least now for the first time ever, we have two candidates for president that. Appear to be on the same page on cannabis. I don’t know that either one of them would ever, you know, give it airtime on a debate, for example, or even say that they agree with the other person. And I completely respect that.

[00:18:48] Katie Neer: But for the industry, that’s good. I think that’s a sigh of relief that we are now looking at two people. potential leaders that don’t believe that cannabis should be schedule one or that people should be put in prison for use, possession, or sale of cannabis. That’s a big deal.

[00:19:06] Ellen Scanlon: Although the country is deeply divided on many issues, legalizing cannabis has gained popularity in both political parties.

[00:19:15] Ellen Scanlon: Vivian offers her perspective on why, despite growing public support, progress in cannabis legalization has moved pretty slowly.

[00:19:25] Vivien Azer: I’ve learned to really keep my expectations low when it comes to cannabis. Even when things get done, it takes so much longer than you anticipate. But you know, the popular support is there.

[00:19:36] Vivien Azer: You can look at the Pew polls and the Gallup polls. It’s becoming increasingly a bipartisan issue. There, there is still a very large divide between Democrats and Republicans, but even now it’s a small majority, maybe 55 percent of Republicans based on the last, I think, Gallup poll are supportive of legalizing cannabis in some form.

[00:19:54] Ellen Scanlon: I asked Vivian to outline key things to watch after we know who the next president will be. What’s at the top of the list? The rescheduling of cannabis.

[00:20:04] Vivien Azer: So the first thing’s going to happen before the inauguration. And so in early December, there are going to be public hearings around rescheduling cannabis.

[00:20:13] Vivien Azer: From schedule one to, to schedule three. And that was an initiative that, that the Biden administration launched under Biden’s term. And Trump has said that he’ll let that proceed. So just understanding kind of the likelihood of rescheduling coming out of the hearing on December 2nd would be the first thing to watch for.

[00:20:33] Vivien Azer: Generally speaking, you know, after an election, you start to get a much clearer picture. clear picture certainly immediately post the inauguration of what the priorities are, especially if you’ve got unilateral control of the White House and Congress. Presidents say a lot based on kind of the first bill that they’re willing to sign and you know what they’re willing to, to talk about.

[00:20:52] Vivien Azer: Certainly under a second Trump administration, I would be paying very close attention to who he nominates as the attorney general. Obviously that’s subject to. Senate approval, but in 2016, that was such a huge disappointment to the cannabis industry. When Jeff Sessions was, was nominated, I happened to have been in Vegas at MJBiz, which is the biggest cannabis conference for the industry in the United States.

[00:21:17] Vivien Azer: And it made, it was like an earthquake. That morning, it was like we were attending a funeral because, you know, there was plenty of kind of public commentary from, from Jeff Sessions that was very, very anti cannabis. Whoever the attorney general is, is going to matter a lot under a Trump presidency.

[00:21:33] Ellen Scanlon: Vivian shares her advice for making your voice count in a way that will be officially noticed by elected officials.

[00:21:41] Vivien Azer: It is very effective to call your representative and your senator. So, as a U. S. citizen with, you know, voting rights, each of those elected officials is required to take note of every voter that calls in to their office that they represent, right? So, don’t call, you know, someone in California if you don’t live in California.

[00:22:04] Vivien Azer: But no one is doing that with Twitter, right? So, you know, getting on Twitter and expressing your support or your outrage or, you know, whatever the sentiment is, like, you’re just like screaming into the abyss. Like, it’s, it doesn’t make a difference, but picking up the phone and vocalizing your support on any given issue is a formal process.

[00:22:23] Ellen Scanlon: If you believe in electing candidates who align with changing attitudes toward cannabis, Katie Neer says do your research and vote.

[00:22:32] Katie Neer: I wish every voter knew in order for cannabis to be legalized and regulated, they do need to vote. They do need to be engaged. So, No meaningful cannabis law has passed both Congress and the Senate, right?

[00:22:47] Katie Neer: So we’ve had fits and starts in either house in the last handful of years. And that’s great. And people are talking about it and there’s plenty of bills to talk about, but we just have this inertia at the federal level. That’s only going to change if we get younger people elected. I think that’s the big rub.

[00:23:05] Katie Neer: There’s always a delay between. public opinion and where our elected officials are. And then it’s even worse when you look at the age and demographics of who’s representing us in DC. It’s easy to tune out to federal politics because it arguably doesn’t touch your life as much as local and state politics.

[00:23:25] Katie Neer: And it does just feel so divisive and sort of exhausting and stressful lately, but it does matter. So it is really important. to stay engaged and to think about this when you are voting and make sure you’re voting for candidates that are on the right side of this issue.

[00:23:43] Ellen Scanlon: Jane West believes in the power of advocacy when it comes to cannabis legalization.

[00:23:48] Ellen Scanlon: It reminds me of a quote from Bill Gates. Most people overestimate what they can do in one year and underestimate what they can do in 10 years.

[00:23:59] Jane West: 10 years ago, when I started, it was Colorado and Washington and everyone was like, that’s a crazy wild west experiment. This is never going to happen. So if all of this could be made up to get to the point where we are in the past 10 years, The next wave of advocacy and people really fighting for access for the next 10 years could change it all over again.

[00:24:19] Jane West: So I do encourage people to get involved and really try to make it so that people have far more access to the plan and far more access to starting businesses in the space.

[00:24:29] Ellen Scanlon: I hope this episode helped answer all your questions about cannabis policy ahead of the election. Please take care of yourself in this complicated pre election moment, and please make a plan to vote.

[00:24:43] Ellen Scanlon: To try to bring some lightness to next week’s episode, which will be live on election day, we are having some fun with a good natured, old fashioned strain battle. It’s between two relaxing strains. They both help with anxiety and pain relief. Who will win our strain battle between Kamala Kush and Trump OG?

[00:25:06] Ellen Scanlon: Stay tuned to find out. Thank you to everyone who entered our Sackville Co giveaway. We have reached out to the winner and I want to send a special congratulations to Ricardo. I hope you enjoy your new apple shaped grinder. Do you like giveaways? Let us know. DM at DoThePot or email hi at DoThePot. com and we’ll work on another one soon.

[00:25:33] Ellen Scanlon: For lots more information and past episodes visit DoThePot. com and that’s also where you can sign up for our newsletter. If you like how to do the pot, please rate and review us on Apple podcasts. It really helps more people find the show. Thanks to producers, Maddy Fair and Nick Patri. I’m Ellen Scanlon and stay tuned for more of how to do the pot.